Interview of the Chargé d'Affaires a.i. of Ukraine to Norway Ihor Holovchenko to the Norwegian media "ABC Nyheter":

https://www.abcnyheter.no/nyheter/norge/2023/11/12/195961292/ukrainas-charge-d-affaires-vil-ikke-akseptere-hvilken-som-helst-fred

Ihor Holovchenko, Chargé d'Affaires a. i. of Ukraine to Norway, believes that only Putin and the Kremlin can make the decision to end the war. But Ukraine has big plans for how to persuade them.

It is more than 20 months since Russia invaded Ukraine. For over 20 months, the Ukrainian people have lived with air raids, missile attacks, power cuts and fear. In the occupied territories, the remaining Ukrainians are also living under Russian rule.

On the ground, progress has been slow in recent months. Neither side is making much progress. There are many indications that the war has turned into a war of attrition.

Now we are facing a new winter. Last winter in Ukraine was characterized by power outages after several Russian attacks on important Ukrainian infrastructure.

In addition, the world has a new war to think about. The war in the Middle East between Israel and Hamas has taken much of the attention away from the war in Ukraine, and many have asked whether this will affect Western economic and military support for Ukraine.

All this was the topic when ABC News met with Ihor Holovchenko, Chargé d'Affaires a.i. of Ukraine to Norway.

Gaza does not change the scale of Russia's war

Holovchenko and his family, his wife, and a daughter less than a year old, are new to the country. The diplomat started his tenure in September and has stayed in the capital Kyiv throughout the war.

- The city is located hundreds of kilometers from the front line, but even there, in the best-protected city in Ukraine, you face risk of missiles and drones falling on your head.

- How would you describe the situation in Ukraine right now?

- The fighting is still ongoing on the battlefield. The situation is not much different from how it was a few months or even a year ago. It is still the biggest ground war in Europe since World War II.

- We see a decrease in attention from some media and politicians after the outbreak of violence in Gaza, but that doesn't change the scale of the war that Russia continues to rage against my country. There are still hundreds of kilometers of active clashes, and dozens of armed attacks every day.

Although there have been reports of heavy Russian casualties since the start of the war, Ukraine is still facing a huge military machine, Holovchenko points out.

Putin's decision

Several experts have stated that a war of attrition is exactly what Russian President Vladimir Putin wants right now. This is to stall for time and make the West war-weary so that they stop their economic and military support for Ukraine.

So, what will it take to reverse this trend and for Russia to withdraw from Ukraine? Holovchenko points to Putin and the Kremlin.

- It is the Kremlin, the Russian elite, led by Putin, who must make the decision that now is the time to end this and pull out. And after almost two years of war, we have seen that the only plausible way to persuade them is on the battlefield.

Russia must be persuaded on the battlefield

- To achieve this, Ukraine, among others, is making a huge diplomatic effort to engage the world. The whole world, not just Europe and North America.

He describes it as getting the world on the same side of history.

- We are ready for peace, but this peace should be comprehensive, just and lasting, it should be based on our territorial integrity, not just any kind of peace - we will not agree to that.

Holovchenko says that unless that happens, they will continue to fight until they push the Russian occupation forces out of Ukraine.

- So we have to be strong enough militarily to persuade the Kremlin that they should give up, or we can continue until we throw them out.

In addition to working on international relations, Ukraine is also working to maintain and expand its industry. At the end of September, Ukraine hosted an international forum for the defense industry in Kyiv, where they invited hundreds of international companies to see what is happening with their own eyes, and to establish partnerships for joint production, maintenance and new technology.

- This is in order to be responsible for much of our own industrial production.

Ukraine has prepared for another difficult winter

Last year's winter was tough in Ukraine. Several Russian attacks knocked out the power grid in several Ukrainian cities. Everyday things like staying warm, cooking and communicating suddenly became difficult.

- Does Ukraine have a plan this winter to prevent a repeat of last year's winter?

- It will probably happen again. We see Russia producing and manufacturing dozens of missiles every month.

In addition to missiles, Ukraine believes that Russia will send more drones this year than it did last year. But the diplomat says that Ukraine and the Ukrainian people are still much more prepared for this winter.

- We have put a lot of effort into physically protecting the critical nodes in the energy network and have saved and stored spare parts. Our air defense system is now also better than last year due to the military support from our partners, but of course it will still be challenging.

He says that now they are ready. They know more about what to expect, and the psychological challenge will probably not be as great as last year.

- Small and medium-sized businesses have also got their own diesel generators, and many, but not all, socially critical institutions such as hospitals, schools and kindergartens have their own generators.  Almost all Ukrainian families now have reflective tape that can be seen in the dark. By the way, I was surprised to see that you have them here in Norway too. The reasons for that are very different, but the solution is the same.

Because when there's a power cut in a city of four million people, you need reflectors so that you can be seen by drivers. Although not as many inhabitants and not under the same conditions, this is something Norwegians are also familiar with.

Norway has not shifted its attention

There is no doubt that military donations from the West have played a major role for the Ukrainians as they have defended themselves against the Russian invasion so far.

Norway has also contributed significantly with military equipment, training and money. This is something that has naturally not gone unnoticed by Holovchenko. But the biggest contributor has been the superpower USA.

However, after the war between Israel and Hamas became a reality, questions arose as to whether Western support would diminish. At least much of the American support. US President Joe Biden stood before Congress and asked for more money to support both Ukraine and Israel. Tormod Heier, a professor at the Norwegian Defense University College, thought this was a bad sign from Ukraine's point of view.

- Are you worried that economic and military support for Ukraine will decrease as a result of the war between Israel and Hamas? Especially support from the US?

- I'm not in a position to comment on what's going on in Washington. My colleagues there will be better equipped to answer that. I can rather answer for Norway. The people and departments I have contact with have not shifted their attention or energy towards the Middle East. These are people who are working to improve relations between Norway and Ukraine, and who help us on a daily basis to win the war. Their functions have not changed - they continue to work.

- So yes, in the media and in high-level politics, the Middle East gets more attention than Ukraine right now, but when it comes to the bureaucracy and those who make decisions, the attention has not disappeared.

Praises Norway and Norwegians

Holovchenko also experiences support from the Norwegian people. Something he would like to thank them for.

- I would like to thank everyone. In my contact with officials, experts, non-governmental organizations and ordinary people, I have felt a lot of empathy and support.

Holovchenko says that he and Ukraine are also very grateful for the way Norway has welcomed Ukrainian refugees. And there are a lot of them, for a country of five million people.

- When I see figures like 60-70,000 Ukrainians already here, we're talking about more than one percent of the population. We are fully aware of the challenges related to this. Both in terms of housing and public transportation.

Holovchenko praises the Norwegian government's clear framework for refugees and believes there is a well-developed immigration program in this country. This means that the refugees who come here can quickly learn Norwegian and enter the labor market and contribute to the Norwegian economy.

- But of course, many of the refugees who have arrived are either elderly, injured or children and they need a lot of support in the first few months, and the support they receive is very much appreciated.  

- Of course, it's not easy when you have the kind of extra pressure on society that a wave of refugees can bring, but it's much easier for Ukrainians in Norway than in many other countries. This is probably one of the reasons why the flow of Ukrainians coming to Norway continues.

The other reason, he believes, is that winter is coming, and with it the many Russian attacks that still threaten many Ukrainians in the months to come.